Your Friday Firestorm #47

By: Steve Evans - May 16, 2008
A10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God, Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal; And had a wall great and high, and had twelve agates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel: On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates. And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.

And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof. And the city lieth foursquare, and the length is as large as the breadth: and he measured the city with the reed, twelve thousand furlongs. The length and the breadth and the height of it are equal. And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel. And the building of the wall of it was of jasper: and the city was pure gold, like unto clear glass. And the foundations of the wall of the city were garnished with all manner of precious stones. The first foundation was jasper; the second, sapphire; the third, a chalcedony; the fourth, an emerald; The fifth, sardonyx; the sixth, sardius; the seventh, chrysolite; the eighth, beryl; the ninth, a topaz; the tenth, a chrysoprasus; the eleventh, a jacinth; the twelfth, an amethyst. And the twelve gates were twelve pearls; every several gate was of one pearl: and the street of the city was pure gold, as it were transparent glass.

(Revelation 21:10-21)

Discuss.

44 Comments »

  1. Sounds pretty. Except too much gold.

    Comment by meems — May 16, 2008 @ 7:34 am

  2. I wonder how expensive real estate is in that town. :)

    Comment by John Scherer — May 16, 2008 @ 7:47 am

  3. Keep Song of Solomon; jettison Revelation. It’s jibberish, as illustrated here, and nothing ever taught in Sunday School, seminary, or BYU has succeeded in the slightest in shedding light.

    Comment by Ardis Parshall — May 16, 2008 @ 7:57 am

  4. Sorry but it’s driving me nuts, I just can’t get past that lady calling Marriage of Figaro “Rachmaninoff” (beginning of the video). BLASPHEMY!! Speaking of blasphemy…

    Comment by sister blah 2 — May 16, 2008 @ 8:11 am

  5. Regarding the actual text–to me, it functions pretty much exactly like one of these images (don’t worry, totally work safe…well, for me anyway! I’m not responsible for anything un-work-safe that YOU see! :-)).

    Comment by sister blah 2 — May 16, 2008 @ 8:17 am

  6. I’m trying to imagine a city that is as high and wide as it is long, all I can think of is a golden Borg cube with crystals.

    Comment by MattG — May 16, 2008 @ 9:18 am

  7. What are all the semi-precious stones doing mingling with the precious stones in heaven? I bet some of them were pissed about that.

    And if I remember anything from my chemistry degree, gold isn’t too transparent. Creative celestial chemistry?

    Comment by peetie — May 16, 2008 @ 9:35 am

  8. I liked seeing that sardonyx is in heaven. I wonder if there’s ironyx and sarcastyx there as well.

    Comment by Steve Evans — May 16, 2008 @ 9:47 am

  9. If Willy Wonka’s chocolate room could also be seen as apocalyptic and/or scripturally allegorical, this is how it would pan out:

    Celestial Kingdom: Belgian chocolate
    Terrestrial Kingdom: Swiss chocolate
    Telestial Kingdom: British chocolate
    Outer Darkness: American chocolate (specifically, Hershey’s)

    I suppose exaltation would include Gene Wilder singing pure imagination while you pass by the umpa-lumpas (sp?) standing as sentinels.

    Comment by JT — May 16, 2008 @ 9:48 am

  10. I’m pretty sure sarcastyx is a big river that divides the teresterial from the outer darkness. Or maybe it’s just the division between one of the degrees in the celestial, you know, those who wouldn’t sail away from those who followed like robots.

    Comment by peetie — May 16, 2008 @ 9:50 am

  11. “Oompa Loompas,” JT.

    Comment by Steve Evans — May 16, 2008 @ 9:52 am

  12. At least there’s no Scotsman to lop off me hed (heeeed) this time. Though that’s no comfort from the threat of several small men rolling me into a large garbage disposal.

    Comment by JT — May 16, 2008 @ 9:55 am

  13. I think it was squirrels.

    Comment by Researcher — May 16, 2008 @ 9:57 am

  14. peetie (10) - One interesting thing I do remember from chemistry is that the earth’s crust is close to 90% silicate, and that when silicates are heated, they turn to glass. I always found that interesting, given the scriptures that discuss the elements melting at the Lord’s coming and the celestialized earth being likened unto a sea of glass.

    Comment by JT — May 16, 2008 @ 10:13 am

  15. 1. meems-
    How about if some of it were Black Hills gold and some of it were white gold? Would that break up the tedium a bit?

    Comment by Jami — May 16, 2008 @ 10:37 am

  16. As I drove passed a building the other day, my son asked if it was made of gold. It, of course, had a glass exterior with a gold colored mirror finish. It was a high as it was tall and wide. Sort of a gold borg cube in fact.

    Comment by BruceC — May 16, 2008 @ 10:48 am

  17. To really understand the intricacies of all this, you need to read the Watchtower. As far as a literal interpretation of the Bible goes, the JW’s paint in far more vivid tones than even BRM’s hallowed tome.

    Comment by Randall — May 16, 2008 @ 10:55 am

  18. #17–For those who don’t have a copy of the Watchtower handy, there’s always Estus Pirkle on youtube.

    Comment by sister blah 2 — May 16, 2008 @ 11:18 am

  19. SB2 FTW. That made my day.

    Comment by Steve Evans — May 16, 2008 @ 11:21 am

  20. Boy that is a scary video. Who are these people?

    Comment by Researcher — May 16, 2008 @ 11:27 am

  21. #18 - Wow! That’s all I have to say about that.

    #15 - Black and White intermingling in Heaven?! Can that really be Biblical?

    The verses immediately following the quoted ones are much more interesting theologically, Steve - at least for someone like me who can’t envision color and luminosity very well. I read about all of the precious stuff and just understand that it will harder to see in Heaven that here on earth, ’cause we’ll all be squinting non-stop from the glare.

    Comment by Ray — May 16, 2008 @ 11:41 am

  22. Ray, we’ll have the ability to polarize our lenses at will, thereby eliminating glare (and finding those trout hiding in the stream) at ease. Glare won’t be a problem.

    Comment by peetie — May 16, 2008 @ 11:48 am

  23. #18-So there is an Oompa-Loompa heaven! Or maybe Lollipop Guild.

    Comment by sol — May 16, 2008 @ 11:49 am

  24. Steve,

    I think sister blah 2 should be the official BCC topical youtube linkmaster from this point onward. Just from this one link alone. “Does this not excite you??!”

    Comment by MattG — May 16, 2008 @ 11:52 am

  25. MattG, agreed.

    Comment by Steve Evans — May 16, 2008 @ 11:55 am

  26. I can’t view the YouTube clip from work, so maybe I’m missing part of the firestorm. But . . .

    I have to agree with Ardis in #3. Some of this mysterious-sounding stuff is not to be understood.

    There is an idea out there that members can (and should) understand even the most difficult scripural passages (including Revelations and Isaiah) if we read and study and ponder and pray enough, provided that we are righteous and in tune with the Spirit.

    It should come as no surprise that some members zealously dive into these kind of passages and don’t come out until they think they’ve found something, including all sorts of crazy notions and deep doctrines and arcane prophesies.

    Unfortunately, some other members seem to feel like they must be somehow less spiritual because they never understand these passages.

    Comment by CE — May 16, 2008 @ 12:01 pm

  27. CE, just go to youtube and search for Estus Pirkle.

    Comment by Mark IV — May 16, 2008 @ 12:06 pm

  28. Jasper seems to get some high praise, and yet there’s no mention of rubies or diamonds.

    I’m surprised we didn’t get our traditional birthstones from these foundations. My Youtube contribution

    Hmm, ninth is topaz, november is topaz, …

    (And now I want a sardonyx pendant.)

    Comment by FHL — May 16, 2008 @ 12:08 pm

  29. CE,

    It doesn’t help that Joseph Smith also once said that the book of Revelation is one of the most literal and straightforward books in the Bible, either. Not that he was prone to hyperbole, of course. ;-)

    Comment by MattG — May 16, 2008 @ 12:12 pm

  30. I love Revelations. It is full of great doctrinal stuff, and a lot of phantasmagoria, which I also enjoy. Note that if we got rid of Revelations we would not only lose a description on the City of God, we would also lose these most Mormon versus, just preceding.

    3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will adwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
    4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
    5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
    6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am bAlpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
    7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.

    ~

    Comment by Thomas Parkin — May 16, 2008 @ 12:25 pm

  31. Thomas Parkin - thank you for that. I needed it at the end of a very, very bad week. Bless you! Sniff, sniff.

    Comment by Single Sister — May 16, 2008 @ 12:41 pm

  32. Being someone who is quite fond of mountains, deserts, and rivers of water, I’m not nearly as attracted to a celestial kingdom all made of gold and crystal. I’m (hopefully) going there because my wife will be there.

    Comment by Kevinf — May 16, 2008 @ 12:44 pm

  33. Amen, TP. There’s a lot of baby in that bathwater.

    Comment by Steve Evans — May 16, 2008 @ 1:00 pm

  34. Another very Mormon part is Rev. 14:6:

    And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,

    The visual image of Moroni with his trumpet on our temples is inspiring and beautiful. Sometimes I travel in connection with my work, and sometimes on a weeknight in a strange town, I go to the temple. Almost always, the first thing I see over the trees is the angel Moroni. It’s like coming home.

    Comment by Mark IV — May 16, 2008 @ 1:08 pm

  35. I’ve found the description of the city as being 12,000 furlongs (or about 1,400 miles) long, wide and high to be interesting. If taken literally, this would be about the distance from Salt Lake City to Chicago, and its height would put it in the earth’s exosphere (perhaps figuratively - or literally! - connecting heaven and earth). Twelve, of course, also has great symbolic meaning in the Old Testament as well as the book of Revelation, and adding a thousand could be a form of emphasis. Nevertheless, that is one huge city.

    Comment by JT — May 16, 2008 @ 1:39 pm

  36. I agree with Thomas Parkin.

    There is some really good stuff in Rev

    War in Heaven
    Importance of works
    Lukewarm in Rev 3

    etc.

    Comment by bbell — May 16, 2008 @ 1:42 pm

  37. http://www.timesandseasons.org/?p=4548

    Comment by Julie M. Smith — May 16, 2008 @ 2:11 pm

  38. Dammit Julie…….

    Comment by Steve Evans — May 16, 2008 @ 2:20 pm

  39. RE: #37 anf #38–

    It would follow from my claims in #26 that Julie has read, studied, pondered, and prayed, and is sufficiently righteous and in tune with the spirit.

    RE: MattG #29–

    Yeah, and Nephi says that Isaiah is easy to understand if you’ve got the spirit of prophesy. Kind of makes you feel like anyone who doesn’t feign understanding of Revelations and Isaiah is basically admitting that they are unworthy.

    Comment by CE — May 16, 2008 @ 2:41 pm

  40. CE, what about those of us who love Isaiah and are agnostic about most of Revelations? The really cool stuff is there, but the rest is no more enlightening to some of us than Deuteronomy - which, btw, also is very straightforward. For that matter, so is Song of Solomon.

    Straightforward might not be such a good thing.

    Comment by Ray — May 16, 2008 @ 4:35 pm

  41. There’s an awfully strange resemblance between this guy and this guy, both in character and in visage.

    Comment by Eric Russell — May 16, 2008 @ 5:34 pm

  42. #18 Those hairstyles are absolutely not part of a perfected body! Now I am afraid that the next time I nod my head in agreement with a sacrament talk, this video will come back to haunt me.

    Comment by Noray — May 16, 2008 @ 6:12 pm

  43. I’m still wondering about the foundation, the twelve apostles, who was # 12. Paul?

    Comment by Lollard — May 16, 2008 @ 9:09 pm

  44. It wouldn’t appear to be Paul since it was Matthias that took Judas’ place.

    Yo que se?

    Comment by AndrewMiller — May 21, 2008 @ 8:09 pm

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